Find our Sentientist Conversation here on the Sentientism YouTube and here on the Sentientism Podcast.

Adam is a Lecturer in Environmental Science at Deakin University. He is an environmental scientist working on questions related to ecology, conservation and society. He is most interested in: i) how concern for Animals informs environmental values and practice, ii) the environmental potential of transitioning to plant-based agriculture and iii) more critical approaches to how the sciences consider Animals. Adam wants to leverage research to help create a better future for Animals, the environment and humans. Adam is also a co-host of the Freedom of Species show on Melbourne’s 3CR community radio.

In Sentientist Conversations we talk about the two most important questions: “what’s real?” & “what matters?”

Sentientism is “evidence, reason & compassion for all sentient beings.” In addition to the video above the audio is on our Podcast here on Apple and here elsewhere.

We discuss:
00:00 Welcome

01:57 Adam’s Intro – “An animal person”. Vegan activist, lecturer & scientist

• The idea that animals matter “took over”

03:16 What’s Real?

• Catholic grandma, mother traumatised by Catholicism, non-religious father
• High-school: enthusiastic atheism & “an affinity with science”
• Uni: learning about the social history & context of religions
• “I’m a proper atheist… I just don’t think there’s anything there”
• “How I think about reality is grounded in natural science”
• Humility re: complex systems (e.g. social, envir)
• Scientism. Science might not have all of the answers
• Reading fantasy & sci-fi: “Religion is just another fantasy book”
• Religious friends. Talking about bible inconsistencies & faith & submission
• “Letting your thinking be done by others – I’m not into that”
• Scepticism “show me the evidence”
• The positives of religious community & connection
• Environment: “Why can’t we love it for what it is rather than investing some sort of supernaturalness into it”
• Faith vs. evidence & reason
• Pseudoscience & “pretend naturalism”
• Conspiracy theories, woo & Goop
• “Pseudoscience tries to use the language of science to trick people”
• QAnon: “That stuff is batshit”
• Teaching science communication
• Flat Earth, Cults & “True Believers”
• The “Oh No Ross & Carrie” podcast https://ohnopodcast.com/
• “Religion is an accepted mass delusion”
• Heaven & hell: “It’s a good way to control people”

33:40 What Matters?

• Social cohesion & relationships
• “Being good to the person next to you… not harming”
• Pluralism: virtues, deontology, utilitarianism, consequentialism
• Evolution of morality: from having young that need care
• “Survival of the most caring?”
• “I don’t want to just propogate my genes any more – that’s why I’m not down the sperm bank every day”
• “Ethicists & philosophers often talk shit”
• The frequent disregard of conservationists for sentients (e.g. culling)
• Conservationist parallels with “white saviourism”?

50:19 Who Matters?

• Anthropocentrism in law, SDGs, rights, culture
• Being anthropocentric & teasing vegetarians “I said all the stupid stuff”
• Chats with a vegetarian & watching Earthlings
• Researching lapwing birds “Would I run out there & eat you? – I wouldn’t”
• Killing birds during scientific conservation work
• Visiting farms “At every dairy farm I saw something atrocious”
• Going vegetarian then vegan then into activism
• Sentient animals garner a particular type of consideration but “I also don’t want to hurt animals that may be not sentient”
• “Live & let live – even with plants… I’m not going to cut down a tree for no reason”
• Degrees of moral consideration
• Predation by domestic cats
• “Humbling our desire to be arbiters of what’s right or wrong in the world”
• Compassionate conservation & Marc Bekoff (previous guest)
• Bio/ecocentrism
• Is worrying about the victims of predation in the wild like “white saviourism”? Is it our role?
• Nearly all mamalian biomass is farmed animals
• The shocking waste of animal agri

01:15:1 How Can We Make a Better World?

• Serving animals at COP26
• Ending animal ag would free up 3/4 of ag land
• UK badger cull “experiment”… “What if we just stop having the cows?”
• “We create these situations – get upset about them – and who suffers?… It’s other sentient animals.”
• “I’m hopeful!… Half the content on the internet is about animals.”
• PHAIR group & psychology
• Rothberger’s “Meat related cognitive dissonace”
• Personal conversations & systemic changes & alternatives
• Simon Anstell’s “Carnage”
• Make it easy, then we can have the “moral revolution”
• Opportunities to be attentive
• “My dog & me – we know how to communicate”
• “Gunda” & “Cow” films
• JustTransition paths for communities with animal ag identities: Transfarmation, Rancher Advocacy Prog, Vegan Soc’s Grow Green

Sentientism is “Evidence, reason & compassion for all sentient beings.” More at Sentientism.info.

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Thanks Graham for the post-production.